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Rule Change Requests for 2016
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TOPIC: Rule Change Requests for 2016

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20202

  • cbuzzetti
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  • Endurance Racer
  • 944 Spec = The best racing on the planet
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dpRacing Dan wrote:
Who needs cookies?

So I did a quick search on Car-Part.com and found roughly 250 rims listed for sale here. The listed prices

I count roughly 250 rims here, starting at $45 ea. Some prices arent listed which generally means you can work a deal, and I'm sure you can work out a GREAT deal for buying multiple sets. I checked this site about 3 months ago and the quantities have not changed, which should indicate that people aren't exactly beating down their doors for them.

According to Stanleys math, this should be enough to supply just over 20 new car builds 3 full sets of rims.


So now it clearly appears that wheels are not in short supply and this is a cosmetic deal. I have personally never heard of a wheel failure in Spec944 but would be happy to hear anyones story about that if it has happened. I believe our wheels are very strong and will outlast any new wheel we purchase. I also race in SpecE30 with an open wheel rule with minimum weight. I have had to buy at least 5 new wheels thks season because they bend so esily. I have bent 2 944 wheels in over 7 years of racing these cars. Both were driver error of hitting a large apex curb head on.
2018 NASA 944Spec National Champ
2018 NASA ST5 P2 944 Nationals COTA
2017 NASA 944Spec WSC P3
2016 NASA PTD-944 WSC P2
2015 NASA GTS1 Western Champion
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2013 NASA 944Spec So-Cal Regional Champion
2013 NASA 944Spec National P3
2010 NASA GTS-1 National Champion
2010 NASA 944Spec National P3
2010 NASA So-Cal 944Spec Regional Champion
2009 NASA 944Spec National Champion

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20203

  • rd7839
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Wow, thanks Dan! There are a ton of wheels here. $85 a piece in Georgia and Virginia. Seems like supply is not an issue anymore.

I called one of those places and they would ship anywhere in the US no problem

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20204

dpRacing Dan wrote:
Who needs cookies?

So I did a quick search on Car-Part.com and found roughly 250 rims listed for sale here starting at $45 ea. Some prices arent listed which generally means you can work a deal, and I'm sure you can work out a GREAT deal for buying multiple sets. I checked this site about 3 months ago and the quantities have not changed, which should indicate that people aren't exactly beating down their doors for them.

According to Stanleys math, this should be enough to supply just over 20 new car builds 3 full sets of rims.


SHIT. I had my new wheels all picked out.
Attachments:
Michael Dearstyne
NASA-SE 944Spec "Commander" Retired
2012 NASA-SE 944Spec Champion
2013 NASA-SE 944Spec Champion

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20208

JUSTMERACING wrote:
dpRacing Dan wrote:
Who needs cookies?

So I did a quick search on Car-Part.com and found roughly 250 rims listed for sale here starting at $45 ea. Some prices arent listed which generally means you can work a deal, and I'm sure you can work out a GREAT deal for buying multiple sets. I checked this site about 3 months ago and the quantities have not changed, which should indicate that people aren't exactly beating down their doors for them.

According to Stanleys math, this should be enough to supply just over 20 new car builds 3 full sets of rims.


SHIT. I had my new wheels all picked out.


Sure would like to have a big ass wing like that one.
If you're not first, you're last!

-Abraham Lincoln

2014 944 Spec Regional Champion
2015 944 Spec Regional Champion

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20209

  • Crooks
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I have been looking for a legitimate reason to oppose the wheel proposal, I haven’t seen one yet. No one has claimed a competitive advantage, no one has claimed a cost issue (you don’t have to buy new wheels; in fact the rule would make the old wheels cheaper). Again nobody is forcing a wheel change, why do some of you oppose this change? Either you are not telling us, or I am missing something.

In my experience, used wheels at $85 each are not a bargain. When I put my car together I bought eight cutters, and 4 phone dials three of the cutters are bad, one out of round and two with excessive run-out, one of the phone dials is so far from balanced that it’s crazy. By the time I pay for the freight or assume the cost to go pick them up, trash the bad ones and have the good ones cleaned up, I could have bought new for about the same price.

If you think we will, or are keeping all of our cars “the same” I am sorry to tell you but that ship sailed a long time ago. We have seen good race cars that cost from $5000 to probably over $25,000 nothing “the same” about them. That doesn’t mean one is faster or better than the other it just means that they are not the same. To be competitively equal does not require them to be the same or identical. Some folks spend more than others. It is a personal preference not a competitive advantage. Just look at the differentness in paint jobs, seats, roll cages, oil sumps, fire systems, dashboards, light systems, fuel cells and engine execution. Huge differences in cost but zero difference in race performance!

Some have time, some have money, (a few have both). That you have the time, space, and equipment and are willing to spend that time looking for and refurbishing wheels is not particularly virtuous. On the other hand it is not a vice to have the cash but not the time, space, equipment to spend more on wheels.

It bothers me that anyone who posts a proposal on this forum would have his motivation questioned. Jason has spent time and effort putting this proposal together. You can be sure that his only motivation is to make the class better. Every proposal deserves honest respectful consideration without having motives questioned. If you have an argument against the proposal, make it. The fact that you don’t like it is not an argument, it is a proclamation.

I am asking; what is the objection to this proposal?

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 5 months ago #20210

Crooks,
My response.

There is no proof that the present wheels are unsafe, unavailable or (and I love this one) a consumable.

A consumable?? Really?? So you are changing them like brake pads and tires?
I call BS.

You call out cost. I can buy good cookies all day long for half the cost of the proposed wheel.

Rules. Now every time we see an aftermarket wheel we will have to wonder if it is legal. Pull it. Check it. Weight it. Not.

And now the real reason I don't want a new wheel. I like the look of an original car with it's original wheel in a "Spec" series. If you want to worry about "Cup" or "SP1" cars not playing with us. I suggest we add a provision to rule 18.1 allowing a one time use with a weight penalty.

Was that clear enough?

P.S. - As Jim Jones once said "I love kool-aid"
Michael Dearstyne
NASA-SE 944Spec "Commander" Retired
2012 NASA-SE 944Spec Champion
2013 NASA-SE 944Spec Champion
Last Edit: 8 years, 5 months ago by JUSTMERACING.
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