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Rule Change Requests for 2016
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TOPIC: Rule Change Requests for 2016

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20190

  • wera44
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rd7839 wrote:
We have given reasons, cost and unnecessary. It's also rules creep, not to mention a spec class is about NOT having choice, it's about everybody having the same equipment.

It also sounds like you haven't yet experienced a broken ball joint. You say you worry about a wheel breaking, which has not happened yet, but not about a ball joint which would have the same effect and happens regularly. Plus, those "new" ball joints are pressed into the old aluminum arm, usually with a cheezy plastic cup. I personally would never run a late car, or at least change to early offset.


Those old "arms" are not old. All this stuff is replaceable with new parts for the most part. I think when you can no longer source new parts for replaceable items it may be time to change the rules a little. I'm just trying to make my car as safe as possible. At the end of the weekend I have a wife and kids to take care of and a business to run. If you see fault in my reasoning so be it.

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20191

  • rd7839
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I don't see fault in your reasoning and I'm glad you're thinking safety. All rancor aside, I personally would ask you to rethink the late offset. No matter how new those arms are they will break at some point. A late car an easily be converted to early offset. I know some people are going to argue with that, and maybe they are right but I have seen those balljoints pull out of the arms and I wouldn't want to be doing triple digit speeds when it happens.

Also please consider a containment and halo seat. Might save your life some day. If you have a Sparco look at the 4 small bolts that thread into the pressed in"nuts" in the side of the seat. that's all that's holding it onto the mount. And drilling into fiberglass is not a good idea. I personally think aluminum is best for us. Again others will disagree

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20194

  • AgRacer
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As wera44 said, control arms can still be sourced as new, wheel studs and tie rods (replacement item on the steering rack) also can still be bought new. You can even still buy new brake calipers and spindles!

But no new wheels.

Thankfully we now have 1 set of cheap cookies available in the heart of the Southeast (Atlanta) region on Craigslist. Unfortunately we have 4 cars being built right now in the Southeast Region, all early offset. My recommendation to all racers after a few seasons of experience is that you need minimum 3 sets of wheels to race conveniently. 1 set for new tires, 1 set for scrubs/practice/old tires, and 1 set for rains. I now need to source 12 sets of cookie cutters for the new cars which will start racing next season. Hopefully each car already comes with them so that gets us down to 9 sets needed. I still dont see the supply readily available without significantly lowering the quality standard and dumpster diving.

As the SE region director, I am now recommending all new and prospective racers source a late offset car solely because the lack of early offset wheels. There are pros/cons to each offset, and to say that late offset is less safe because of the ball joints is a valid viewpoint, but I have also seen several early balljoints break in the last 2 seasons of racing. The spindle (speedo hole) can also be a weak point in the early offset as well as the weld that wraps the sheet steel around the attatchment point to the crossmember. In the end, its really a wash between early and late offset suspensions and a healthy dose of preventive maintenance, inspections can catch most issues before they become a problem.

What I have provided is a very valid, well researched solution for a growing class. This rule change is proposed with the belief that the class is growing nationally, and we need to take steps now to shore up our viability before it becomes a real issue. As was mentioned before, SE30 and SM both use this rule in very tight spec racing with incredible success. Now that SP1 is getting its own championship in PCA with the joining of 944Cup to the official PCA structure, we may see even more 944Spec/SP1 cars nationally in areas where NASA isnt as popular (TX, Northeast). Add all of these cars into the demand cycle for parts/wheels.

If you are against this rule, I question your honest dedication to improving the class for the purpose of keeping it viable and visible in each of the regions around the country. This is not rules creep, we have reached a point where it is time to move in a direction because of valid reasons. Allowing coil overs would be rules creep. As would allowing chips, ported heads, aftermarket cams, deleting balance shafts, aftermarket body panels, wings... all rules creep because it is not needed.

Aftermarket wheels are NOW needed.
J. Stanley
NASA-SE Region 944 Spec Series Director
Yellow #60

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20196

  • wera44
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I havent heard of ball joints being an issue but I'll look into it. Almost all my suspension is new or newer.

I'm running the Racetech full containment seat in my car. It was the safest seat I could buy that fit me well. I have never heard of fiberglass in those seats being an issue.

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20198

  • 1M Fan
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I've been 3 feet from a concrete wall at triple diget speed when my steel left control arm broke. The rest of the ride was a bit hair raising. Just saying, any of these parts can break, even new ones.

Re: Rule Change Requests for 2016 8 years, 9 months ago #20201

  • dpRacing Dan
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  • 944 Spec National Director
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Who needs cookies?

So I did a quick search on Car-Part.com and found roughly 250 rims listed for sale here starting at $45 ea. Some prices arent listed which generally means you can work a deal, and I'm sure you can work out a GREAT deal for buying multiple sets. I checked this site about 3 months ago and the quantities have not changed, which should indicate that people aren't exactly beating down their doors for them.

According to Stanleys math, this should be enough to supply just over 20 new car builds 3 full sets of rims.
Last Edit: 8 years, 9 months ago by dpRacing Dan.
The following user(s) said Thank You: cbuzzetti
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