Brian Evans wrote:

Brian, see if you can get more folks to join in here.

Dan, I watched your VIR video (Jason's too) from last year. What can we do about the way your shifter moves of its own free will?

Ok, this is going to be long.

I would love to have as many of you as possible involved in my motor build and am willing to work with anyone who wants to get the facts up. The "Build" topic that I read on this site does not go into the engine at all, unless I missed something, so this seems like a good addition. I can supply the motor but I need someone in Texas to supply the car, as mine is still a shell at the moment.

Since this is in a RULES topic, I would like all of you to chime in on some of my concerns which I can incorporate into the dyno testing when the motor is done and in. Some of what follows will bother some of you. I'll try to address that at the very end or in subsequent posts. Please have an open mind and understand that ignorance (not a bad word) hurts in SPEC unless we all have the same level of it.

1- Having a programmable DME is a problem for me. I know racers. If they can they will and if they don't know how they will complain that someone else has. Easy solution: Everyone uses the early DME/AFM combination.
NOTES: Better perception of SPEC, Easier TECH, No additional cost (perhaps money back since late DMEs and AFMs seem to sell for more than early DMEs and AFMs). Regarding age and breakage: I am an EE by education and pretty good with a soldering iron. Tim has already said he can fix your DMEs and I will dig into mine and post any issues along with fixes so everyone here knows what's up. (((Sorry Tim, I have always told fellow racers how (if I know) and let them decide if they want to DIY or send it to me, or in this case you, for repair. I won't compete with you on this repair, promise.))) The only potential problem I see here would be if I can fiddle with the FQS circuitry to manipulate the ignition timing (advance rather than retard). If I can do that, then we have another problem.

2-I really struggle with my early cam. Anyone have a late cam tower they could lend to this project for back to back testing?

3-I love the idea of a benevolent dictator, but IF my ideas plant big enough seeds of doubt, or seem to make sense, does it make sense to have a committee in the short term? And yes Dan, this has a little to do with the fact that your shifter dances around.

4-Block. My cylinders were within spec everywhere but the very top, where they were what I term "a mess." The mic was jumping all over the place as I moved it up and down through the top. Ten years ago I knew that sleeving was not allowed and I found someone who could bring the block back to spec through Nikasil coating, so we threw it in the hone (I used to build Spec Miata motors) to see what it really needed to clean up. We needed to go 0.004 to 0.008" before the holes came back to perfect, too much for me to be happy putting the pistons back in. Think I am the only one who has fixed his block? IF you are thinking of an aftermarket piston, my suggestion would be to make it a 0.2mm oversize that follows the specs of the 9.5 pistons (no lighter). NOTES: I've "Whistled" quite a few of our motors and will tell all of you that in order to whistle at the limit of the rules, we had to build 0.3-0.4 CR points OVER the spec. IF this applies to the 944, then (remember there are smart, "build to the limit" guys out there and they are probably in this class already) you have true 10.8 CR motors out there, and you don't get there by just throwing HC piston in an otherwise stock block. Forget about checking the CR in TECH with fluids and plates. You can't get accurate and repeatable that way and really, what's the point? None of us want to take our cars apart after a race. Rely on the Whistler and write/right the rules for checking CR the same way you did for the dyno (adding my suggestions I hope:-) ) understanding that the MAX CR stated in rules might drop to 10.2 or so, if the whistler delivers lower than actual. This can easily be tested with my build.

5-Shifters Little story here. I used to ride hare scrambles with Kent Howerton (look him up if that name doesn't ring a bell). One day we were riding at his house (big spread outside San Antonio) and I asked him to jump on my bike to see if he could suggest some suspension changes, etc. He got of my bike after one lap and told me to get on his bike. Oh my, every control was perfect. Silky throttle, no slop in the brake and clutch handles and instant engine/throttle response. "Go fix that "stuff" first and then we can talk about the suspension." Did I make the point, or was that too vague?

6-Wheels If you want this class to have greater numbers, you need to get on this too. Dan, please contact me on this. 512 four two three 9740

7-Tires Why are we putting a 225 on a seven inch rim? Has anyone tested with a 205/50? It certainly fits the rim better and it's less expensive. Anyone have pictures of their 225s that have been run down to cord? I'd love to see the wear patterns. I'm totally ignorant here, but can't see the logic. Anyone?

Man, you are WAY overthinking things! For the record I have a low compression engine with a fresh cylinder head and stock cam timing and I had to tune things down to make horsepower.

We like to keep things tight in this class and it works. Not many of our cars are built to optimized ruleset. Most are stock rebuilds and just need a little tweaking to get up to the power cap. If you enjoy chasing the last little bit, more power to you(pun intended) but it won't get you to the front!

I know what you're saying about racers taking advantage of the rules, and may bend them, or flat out cheat but I can honestly say at least out west, if you are even suspected of cheating you will be called out and shunned. It's already happened. I firmly believe that none of our guys would purposely cheat. and most of us would dq ourselves if something is not right. Also most, if not all of the cars out here run well below the rules limits.

I think the time is not right for aftermarket pistons. There are plenty of stock ones out there, although the '88's may be harder to find, it's been proven time and again that they are not necessary.

We also have proven that wheels are readily available and cheap. The stock wheels are also incredibly strong and are not failing, the only reason for aftermarket wheels is for looks and that is a horrible reason. Also without testing back to back, just going by what the manufacturer says is a bad idea. I would be for it if thorough testing is done across a few different regions. The costs quoted are also misleading. $700 is really closer to $1,600. Tax, shipping and an extra set bumps it up. If you have to run phonies, that's the price of running a late car! For $1,600 you can convert to early offset with wheels and still have money left over for a race entry fee!

I'm ambivalent towards the shifter. Doesn't cost a bunch and although it will be a slight advantage, like Chuck says it's not much in the real world. I will say that if your shifter is sloppy, it can easily be fixed for a handful of change and a little work! I can walk you thru the process, or look it up online. Before the 44 only shifter was allowed, I rebuilt mine with needle bearing washers and a bolt I had already. The linkage was only a little more involved. The slop was in the white plastic piece that connects the rod to the lever. Just take the snap ring off, file the plastic a little bit and add a washer to take up the slack. As for the locating arm, your local hardware store will have replacement bushings for about $.25. Or you can go to a motorcycle junkyard and get a rear brake lever linkage that's the same length, cost about $5!

I just spent considerable time reading all the posts.

After Market Wheels: Good idea making them available in both offsets and at the weight equal to the lightest wheel currently allowed on the car.

Short shifter: Charlie is right you can only shift this transmission so fast. Also given the age of the drivers I see in our class I doubt the reflect time is lightning fast. Sorry folks we are older and the reflexes are slower. We all miss shift and the shifter and linkage were designed for driving around town and not racing, plus it is 30 years old. We should allow the proposed replacement.

Pistons. I am not an engine geek. As I see it we have a HP and torque combination cap so if someone wants to spec in an after market piston fine. The cap will control the issue.

DME Out west we do not seem to have failures maybe its because it is hot and dry and never rains. I lived in the midwest and it rains and is humid so I understand your challenges with this failure issue. The following is a joke. Maybe you should all consider moving to California or Arizona and that problem would go away. HMMM seems expensive for a solution. If we can determine that the new DME offers no advantage then I am fine with a specified non OEM DME. Again the HP/TORQUE cap would seem to be a good control rule regarding this issue.

Chuck I cannot remember what your suggestion was but I am fine with it as well. We do not have humidity but we have heat issue. Changing rod bearing frequently is required. For you midwest and east coast racers who will be moving to California and Arizona as a solution to the DME problem we do race in 100 degree ambient temperature. The good news it is a dry heat. You survive but the car and its components cook.

If I missed any of the suggestions I am sorry but those I remember and have a view on accepting them into the rules.

When I reviewed the rules thread there were good suggestions under making the car cost effective, more reliable and more efficient to maintain but nothing on safety. To me safety should come first and the rules should in no way impede safety.

I am 6'3" tall and correct weight for that height. While I was prematurely gray the hair color now fits the age. For those of you younger drivers that means I am not a bendable.

To maximize safety I use a halo style seat from Cobra. The seat is paced as far back as possible and is against the rear cage elements. It is bolted to the floor so all to allow maximum clearance from the roof elements of the cage.

So why this introduction, as the rules are written today they do not allow for optimization of safely exiting the car in an emergency situation if the seat is placed to maximize its safety value. The paragraph notation below are from the NASA CCR's. Because of this safety conflict in our rules I propose the following changes. To my knowledge in no way will they create a performance advantage. They will increase safety of our vehicles.

The rules already allow for moving of pedals 3". However, it does not provide for moving the steering column and/or shifter to accommodate the change in pedal location.


We suggest that the rule be changed as follows:

(17.2.5 The foot pedals (i.e. throttle, brake, and clutch) may be modified for driver comfort and accessibility. Pedals, steering column and shifter may be moved to allow safe driver exit from vehicle as required by the CCR 16.2.2 Emergency Exit Time. spacers are limited to a maximum of 3 inch extensions measured from the factory pedal face.


16.2.2 Emergency Exit Time

The vehicle should be setup to allow drivers to exit the car quickly in an emergency. Drivers should be tested

from time to time to ensure that they can meet the specified time for exiting the car in the event of an

emergency. The driver must demonstrate the ability to exit their car within ten (10) seconds by opening the

door (for cars with doors) or open-top vehicles (e.g. formula / sports racers); and within fifteen (15) seconds by

way of the window opening for sedans and sports cars. Drivers must be wearing all of their required driver’s

gear and be tightly belted into the driver’s seat when the clock starts. Anyone who fails this test may be

penalized with penalties ranging from a warning to exclusion from participation until corrections are made.

Note- passing the Emergency Exit Time test does not guarantee anything, as many different situations may

present themselves in a real emergency. The test is an exercise for the driver as well as functioning to

demonstrate the ability to exit the vehicle.

KJZ78701

First- the shifter. The video you're watching from VIR is BEFORE I replaced my components with the Only944 components. Unfortunately, Eastern Nats 2016 would have been my only footage WITH the new components, but this was dashed by a miata that took me out before I could even record any laps (car totaled in first warm up session).
I can email you PLENTY of cell-phone videos we've taken of our newest build using the Only944 parts currently allowed. The shifter feels like a winchester rifle.

"Having a programmable DME is a problem for me". I'm not sure you correctly understand. This DME is not easily programmable. Infact, the reason I worked with F9Tech was because their previous offering was too easily opened and chipped. This new DME is sealed, and does NOT offer a E-Prom port, which means its actually incredibly more difficult to modify or program than an original unit. F9Tech has assured me, without a CONSIDERABLE ammount of knowledge, skills, and software programming abilities to hardware a modification to their units is extremely unlikely. These have already been dyno-proven to not alter performance.

"I love the idea of a benevolent dictator, but IF my ideas plant big enough seeds of doubt, or seem to make sense, does it make sense to have a committee in the short term?"
That's what this forum is for. This procedure is actually not required, but a courtesy to all the 944 Spec racers as I value your opinions. If you're uncomfortable with the way this works, I think you'd have to contact NASA central to discuss the way they structure their entire series.

"Wheels If you want this class to have greater numbers, you need to get on this too. Dan, please contact me ". I would strongly disagree that wheels are stopping people from building cars. We proved last year factory rims are readily available nation wide using sites like car-part.com. I have yet to see a wheel "fail". I've only seen some bend after major curb abuse. I'm not totally against allowing aftermarket wheels, but this argument doesn't carry any weight with me.
Again, the wheel mnfg I worked with made a rim that EXACTLY replicates dimensions and overall weight of factory rims, both early AND late offsets. They are out there. They are $700 a set. They wont offer any big advantage- but do we need them or will this benefit our entire series? I agree this is mostly a cosmetic request.

"Tires Why are we putting a 225 on a seven inch rim? Has anyone tested with a 205/50? It certainly fits the rim better and it's less expensive. Anyone have pictures of their 225s that have been run down to cord? I'd love to see the wear patterns. I'm totally ignorant here, but can't see the logic. Anyone?"
.79" narrower of a tire x 4 tires = 3.14" LESS of contact patch, which in turn equals slower cars. I personally am not interested in making our cars any slower.
The savings is $18 per tire, or $72 per set. My advice is to win more Toyo Bucks